As a long-time Nintendo fan and Wii-owner I’m incredibly excited about Natal; had to pick my jaw up off the floor after the “Milo” demo. Now to save up for a 360.
Seriously, I’m not afraid to admit it: Xbox kicked butt this year at E3.
Fake! I just shot the exact same video in my living room with my friends basking in some TV glow while they were making gestures that might fit with the noises we were hearing…
My big issue, if this is supposed to be so great, why not SHOW that D@&m thing action? Hearing the developers talk and talk and act like goons on screen is one thing. Showing the actual image/game reacting to the goons acting weird and all would make me believe in what they are selling.
Until I SEE what is going on – it’s just a bunch of sound efx and talking heads.
Doesn’t anyone find it scary that if this, and sony’s new controller for that matter, becomes the new hot thing to have, that there will be alot of cameras and/or mic’s in everyone’s home? Cameras that are hooked up to a console that are connected the the net? I bet someone will find a way to exploit it. Even if that doesn’t happen, i doubt i can sit comfortably on my couch having a camera pointed at me all the time. Even if i know its turned off…
Because of my employment and my awesome bossL)…I am very lucky to be at E3 this year and I have to say.I have used Natal, and while it is quite innovative, i dont see it being used for much other than minigames and wii-sports esque games without some sort of add-on peripheral. For instance, in order to play a game such as Halo, or any other free moving shooter, you would need an attachment or peripheral in order to move freely around the game space. It is VERY cool, and Milo is…interesting.
Firstly, I have to say I’m incredibly interested in Project Natal. Not so much in the context of gaming control, but more as a pure user interface. The Milo demo was amazing and I really want to interact with my devices in the free human-like manner displayed in the demo
There’s some serious problems with this, though. How, for example, do you play in the dark? I assume there’ll be infrared/night vision cameras too? Am I the only one who’d be incredibly uncomfortable with Microsoft having an internet-connected camera in my living room? All of the demos I’ve seen seem to required quite obvious, big movements.
Apart from that, it looks good, and I’m interested to see where developers will take this kind of interface.
While the tech is impressive, literally all this stuff EyeToy has been doing since PS2. I’m not even kidding. I find Sonys true 1:1 wand stuff way more interesting though. It’s like what the Wiimote should of been, and some more
Dave: The EyeToy is a neat product, but it has some serious limitations. First is that, at least in its PS2 incarnation, the software is relatively unsophisticated in its ability to recognize you from the background. Basically, if a part of the image is “moving” it’s part of you. The second is that because it uses a standard camera, it has no depth perception.
Project Natal uses a 3D camera (not sure if its just stereoscopic or if it uses some other mechanism) which combined with some fancier image recognition algorithms allow it to sense your motion in 3D space with reasonable precision. One of the demos that has been reported on was a modified version of Burnout Paradise that allowed you to drive the car by moving your hands as if turning a steering wheel and accelerate by pushing your foot forward as if pushing in the pedal.
Now, I don’t know if any good games will actually come out of this tech, but it definitely seems capable of a lot more than older camera-based input tech.
One of the things people have to realize (and I’m looking at YOU, naysayers) is that all of these things: the EyeToy, the Wiimote and Natal, are all incremental advances in this realm of interactive control. Simply expect Natal to be much better than previous technologies, but don’t expect perfection. Think about the point we’re at now, where something like Natal gets introduced, and it is NOT part of the next-generation XBox… when it is released, it will work for the one you currently own. None of us have physically tried it ourselves, we’ve only seen videos online, of selected people, playing (most likely) specialized Natal scenarios. If the technology really is viable, the developers will jump on it, and create ways to use it that MS never thought of. THAT is where the really good times come. Natal is just a tool, and the really big responsibility lies on honest reviews, and if positive, then creative developers. Personally I’m more excited by the advancement of the tech, than I am for the actual product… the good stuff will come later.
Wow, build a perfect mousetrap, and they will invent an angrier internet man to complain that it only catches ONE mouse at a time. Playing in the dark? seriously? You own a xbox but not basic lighting? If this technology never does anything more than play the one demo ball kicking game they showed at e3 it is STILL a huge jump for technology. Hell the second I saw this I started planning out a chain of natal gaming centers in my head. This is the beginning of what we have always been promised, try not to piss all over it too soon hehehe. I am daydreaming about a day when I can use my years of fencing practice to pwn noobs in the battleground! (instead of getting facemelted by every space octopus) I know this doesn’t sound ideal for everyone, but as of yesterday I hate MS about 60% less. When win7 releases I may actually push the meter from hate to “meh”
Yeah, this is juuust like the EyeToy, cuz they both, you know, have cameras. This goes way beyond anything that’s been on the consumer market, past or present. Yes, it has similarities to other products, but it’s like comparing an iPhone to a rotary phone.
A few things to consider:
1) Most developers got their dev kits 2 days ago. I know we live in an insta-everything society, but OMG give it time! I’m guessing it’ll be about 1-2 YEARS before we see a real game to critique how this thing really works.
2) No, the demonstrators didn’t have to make big movements all the time, the cameras were picking up even subtle movements (look at the folks steering in the YouTube vids). But A) The large gestures have to do with the human need to overcompensate (memories of HDTV screens embedded with Wiimotes come to mind), and, B) At the conference, they’re on a live stage, you have to make big movements so the people can see you, it’s a theater thing.
3) Moving through the environment of a FPS-like game (hopefully) especially shouldn’t require a controller. In theory, you walk in place and the camera tells the game code to translate that to forward movement, etc. Imagine, instead of pressing button X to duck down, you just… duck. Now, whether developers will figure that out remains to be seen.
“Project Natal uses a 3D camera (not sure if its just stereoscopic or if it uses some other mechanism) which combined with some fancier image recognition algorithms allow it to sense your motion in 3D space with reasonable precision.”
This is simply a “dumbed down” (not meant as an insult) optical tracking unit. One camera captures normal video, another IR for depth. All meaningful results come out of whatever processing they are using with built in hardware of the unit. Remember that there is a reason for more accurate motion capture they use reflective balls on joints, this will approximate about 47 points, not sure if that means per person or total. Expect this to be at least a year off for anything more interesting than tech demos, as they have said they are just now getting units to devs. I’m so so on this. Neat example of tech trickling down to consumers, but since i’ve had an accident where i badly injured my back, i have no interest (or ability) to play games that require me to make it worse. Also, i don’t know about others, but i prefer something tangible to touch when gaming. That combined with other things is why i’m probably more interested in the Sony device.
The Milo demo got me quite interested in this. Being able to converse in realtime with the game characters would lend itself very well to RPGs or adventure games. I wonder how far away Milo is from being Turing compliant.
@Jaramide – the Milo demo was actually a little creepy in some ways. If that thing comes out, I’m going to feel like I’m going to have to cover the TV to be sure everything is off or I’ll feel like someone is watching me!
@Matthew – was that really necessary? You couldn’t have come up with something a bit better?
OK, this is the first real step towards the Holodeck.
Now when can I throw a chair at Steve Ballmer?
Uau this is the future ladies and gentlemen…
If Natal is as awesome as it is this is a FATALITY Blow on any wii stuff out there at the present and future times!
As a long-time Nintendo fan and Wii-owner I’m incredibly excited about Natal; had to pick my jaw up off the floor after the “Milo” demo. Now to save up for a 360.
Seriously, I’m not afraid to admit it: Xbox kicked butt this year at E3.
The folks over at Gizmodo have posted their thoughts on Natal and they sound pretty excited about it! You can read it for yourselves here:
http://gizmodo.com/5277954/testing-project-natal-we-touched-the-intangible
I can’t wait to get my hands on this myself.
Fake! I just shot the exact same video in my living room with my friends basking in some TV glow while they were making gestures that might fit with the noises we were hearing…
1) I want to get one of them SDKs they’re talking about. Sign me up.
2) That guy reminds me of Tony Stark as portrayed in the recent Iron Man film
My big issue, if this is supposed to be so great, why not SHOW that D@&m thing action? Hearing the developers talk and talk and act like goons on screen is one thing. Showing the actual image/game reacting to the goons acting weird and all would make me believe in what they are selling.
Until I SEE what is going on – it’s just a bunch of sound efx and talking heads.
haha. Why is it that the star wars kid comes to mind when i watch this?!
nice shades
It’s interesting that the demo is in a completely white room. It’s probably much easier for the camera to distinguish shapes with a solid background.
If it works like they say it’s going to, I may have to buy an XBox 360.
Doesn’t anyone find it scary that if this, and sony’s new controller for that matter, becomes the new hot thing to have, that there will be alot of cameras and/or mic’s in everyone’s home? Cameras that are hooked up to a console that are connected the the net? I bet someone will find a way to exploit it.
Even if that doesn’t happen, i doubt i can sit comfortably on my couch having a camera pointed at me all the time. Even if i know its turned off…
Because of my employment and my awesome bossL)…I am very lucky to be at E3 this year and I have to say.I have used Natal, and while it is quite innovative, i dont see it being used for much other than minigames and wii-sports esque games without some sort of add-on peripheral. For instance, in order to play a game such as Halo, or any other free moving shooter, you would need an attachment or peripheral in order to move freely around the game space. It is VERY cool, and Milo is…interesting.
Did they mention that the device only work with bearded men wearing glasses ?
Firstly, I have to say I’m incredibly interested in Project Natal. Not so much in the context of gaming control, but more as a pure user interface. The Milo demo was amazing and I really want to interact with my devices in the free human-like manner displayed in the demo
There’s some serious problems with this, though. How, for example, do you play in the dark? I assume there’ll be infrared/night vision cameras too? Am I the only one who’d be incredibly uncomfortable with Microsoft having an internet-connected camera in my living room? All of the demos I’ve seen seem to required quite obvious, big movements.
Apart from that, it looks good, and I’m interested to see where developers will take this kind of interface.
Why is he wearing shades indoors?
Chris: The depth map is 100% based on IR not visible spectrum.
While the tech is impressive, literally all this stuff EyeToy has been doing since PS2. I’m not even kidding. I find Sonys true 1:1 wand stuff way more interesting though. It’s like what the Wiimote should of been, and some more
Bomber X, you beat me to it
id say a lot of the xbox’s current users are teenagers or the like up in their bedrooms not a great add-on for them with the space issue.
I wear my sunglasses indoors so I can, so I can watch you weave [your body hither and yon]
excellent…return of the drug dealer…:p
Dave: The EyeToy is a neat product, but it has some serious limitations. First is that, at least in its PS2 incarnation, the software is relatively unsophisticated in its ability to recognize you from the background. Basically, if a part of the image is “moving” it’s part of you. The second is that because it uses a standard camera, it has no depth perception.
Project Natal uses a 3D camera (not sure if its just stereoscopic or if it uses some other mechanism) which combined with some fancier image recognition algorithms allow it to sense your motion in 3D space with reasonable precision. One of the demos that has been reported on was a modified version of Burnout Paradise that allowed you to drive the car by moving your hands as if turning a steering wheel and accelerate by pushing your foot forward as if pushing in the pedal.
Now, I don’t know if any good games will actually come out of this tech, but it definitely seems capable of a lot more than older camera-based input tech.
One of the things people have to realize (and I’m looking at YOU, naysayers) is that all of these things: the EyeToy, the Wiimote and Natal, are all incremental advances in this realm of interactive control. Simply expect Natal to be much better than previous technologies, but don’t expect perfection. Think about the point we’re at now, where something like Natal gets introduced, and it is NOT part of the next-generation XBox… when it is released, it will work for the one you currently own.
None of us have physically tried it ourselves, we’ve only seen videos online, of selected people, playing (most likely) specialized Natal scenarios. If the technology really is viable, the developers will jump on it, and create ways to use it that MS never thought of. THAT is where the really good times come. Natal is just a tool, and the really big responsibility lies on honest reviews, and if positive, then creative developers. Personally I’m more excited by the advancement of the tech, than I am for the actual product… the good stuff will come later.
Wow, build a perfect mousetrap, and they will invent an angrier internet man to complain that it only catches ONE mouse at a time. Playing in the dark? seriously? You own a xbox but not basic lighting? If this technology never does anything more than play the one demo ball kicking game they showed at e3 it is STILL a huge jump for technology. Hell the second I saw this I started planning out a chain of natal gaming centers in my head. This is the beginning of what we have always been promised, try not to piss all over it too soon hehehe. I am daydreaming about a day when I can use my years of fencing practice to pwn noobs in the battleground! (instead of getting facemelted by every space octopus) I know this doesn’t sound ideal for everyone, but as of yesterday I hate MS about 60% less. When win7 releases I may actually push the meter from hate to “meh”
Yeah, this is juuust like the EyeToy, cuz they both, you know, have cameras. This goes way beyond anything that’s been on the consumer market, past or present. Yes, it has similarities to other products, but it’s like comparing an iPhone to a rotary phone.
A few things to consider:
1) Most developers got their dev kits 2 days ago. I know we live in an insta-everything society, but OMG give it time! I’m guessing it’ll be about 1-2 YEARS before we see a real game to critique how this thing really works.
2) No, the demonstrators didn’t have to make big movements all the time, the cameras were picking up even subtle movements (look at the folks steering in the YouTube vids). But A) The large gestures have to do with the human need to overcompensate (memories of HDTV screens embedded with Wiimotes come to mind), and, B) At the conference, they’re on a live stage, you have to make big movements so the people can see you, it’s a theater thing.
3) Moving through the environment of a FPS-like game (hopefully) especially shouldn’t require a controller. In theory, you walk in place and the camera tells the game code to translate that to forward movement, etc. Imagine, instead of pressing button X to duck down, you just… duck. Now, whether developers will figure that out remains to be seen.
im looking forward to this… it looks really neat.
i dont know how well it will work with all games, but i think subtle implementation will be great
“Project Natal uses a 3D camera (not sure if its just stereoscopic or if it uses some other mechanism) which combined with some fancier image recognition algorithms allow it to sense your motion in 3D space with reasonable precision.”
This is simply a “dumbed down” (not meant as an insult) optical tracking unit. One camera captures normal video, another IR for depth. All meaningful results come out of whatever processing they are using with built in hardware of the unit. Remember that there is a reason for more accurate motion capture they use reflective balls on joints, this will approximate about 47 points, not sure if that means per person or total. Expect this to be at least a year off for anything more interesting than tech demos, as they have said they are just now getting units to devs.
I’m so so on this. Neat example of tech trickling down to consumers, but since i’ve had an accident where i badly injured my back, i have no interest (or ability) to play games that require me to make it worse. Also, i don’t know about others, but i prefer something tangible to touch when gaming. That combined with other things is why i’m probably more interested in the Sony device.
But why does the dev guy have to look like a fuckign cunt?
The Milo demo got me quite interested in this. Being able to converse in realtime with the game characters would lend itself very well to RPGs or adventure games. I wonder how far away Milo is from being Turing compliant.
@Jaramide – the Milo demo was actually a little creepy in some ways. If that thing comes out, I’m going to feel like I’m going to have to cover the TV to be sure everything is off or I’ll feel like someone is watching me!
@Matthew – was that really necessary? You couldn’t have come up with something a bit better?
So this is pre – natal state of being …
Will we get a post – natal depression ?